Something Funny but not so Funny!

[OnieRN]

You will never believe what happened! I uploaded one of my LO to Walmart to get an 8 x 10 print. When I went to pick it up, the guy told me that they could not print it under Federal Copyright laws. I questioned him more by asking what the heck was he talking about. He suggested that I had a professional picture in my layout. I really got ticked because it wasn't. I had cropped a bunch of junk out of a picture of my granddaughter and the guy insisted that it was a professional picture. In fact, he orginally thought my LO was professional done and the entire LO was illegal. The next day, I took my defective picture to Walmart to prove that it was not a professional picture and that my scrapbooking was designed to look professional. He said that another reason it was a professional picture was because it had a date and logo in the corner. The so called logo was an embellishment I used with the date!

Needless to say, I let him know that he would never be blessed with my business again! What a Creep!!!

nie

[eye]

well I sent mine to wall-Mart and they made a mess out of my picures. They kept cutting heads off. So now I go to the developers at Scrapbook max and they do a lovely job.

[poppabob]

I'm a cranky old sort at times. I believe I would have said "Thanks for the compliment. I'm the copyright holder. Please send for your manager."

[OnieRN]

Hey Poppa

He was the manager!

nie

[Granny]

Amen, poppabob!!!!!

Onie.... Way to go girl!

Granny

[ToniNZ]

What a great compliment! .....but I'd still vote with my dollar and don't shop there again.

[OnieRN]

Oh, I have to!!!

No way I can stop shopping at Walmart but I certainly don't have to do any pics there. I was actually wanting to do a quick framed pic for my parents. I've been printing my own pages, but still unable to get borderless. I have tried everything from SBM settings to my printer settings. All indicators say I should print borderless but NOPE!!!! At one point, my settings printed borderless on 2 sides but not 4. The idea of having to cut edges off the pages just doesn't please me!

Oh Well, I love my SBM and especially everyone I've met here on the forum! The group is the BEST EVER!

nie

[Lee]

The clerk was just doing his job

I'm not defending WalMart but retailers have been sued and paid significant damages for copyright infringement. Photographers and other artists are in a battle to retain control over their works. This is the same problem as music and video downloads. Digital media has made it that much easier for anyone to steal intellectual property.

This is the same reason why SBM doesn't allow copyrighted materials to be posted here for sharing. Someone owns that material and sharing it is the same as stealing. All my material such as tutorials are marked ©2006 Digital Photo Guy, Inc. My copyrights are owned by my company. Usually, I also include a phrase that allows limited distribution rights. Bottom line, I don't want someone else to profit by selling my work. In the worst case, I don't want someone else to prevent me from using my own work by copyrighting something I created and failed to copyright.

Copyright confers to the photographer the moment an image is captured. The problem arises in asking minimum wage clerks to make legal/artistic decisions. To play it safe (keep their jobs), many err on the side of caution.

It's a complex issue and I hope I've helped shed some light on it.

[poppabob]

You're right Lee, it is a complex issue.

I believe the problem arises not so much from asking a clerk to make these decisions as it does from an over zealous and greedy legal system going after the deep pockets rather than going after the thief. I believe that's the real reason why I could go in to a place like Wal-mart and have someone basically tell me, "this looks too good, it couldn't be yours, therefore I'm denying you service so as to cover my corporate assets.".

[OnieRN]

My Question is......

Do I put Copyright by Onie on my work? I mean, it was my work and I should not have to defend my own work, just to get the dang thing printed. I guess I will continue to print my own from home and deal with the borders!

I am perfectly aware of copyrights, that is why I do not post on the site here, because I honestly do not know where a lot of my stuff came from. I download everything that I can get my hands on. I figure if I don't post my work, then I don't have to worry about violating any copyrights. I'm actually proud of the pages I've done and wished I could share them. Occasionally, I will post a page in the gallory!

nie

[Lee]

Let's all take a deep breath...

Do I put Copyright by Onie on my work?

If you want to protect it from being exploited by unscrupulous downloaders, yes, you should copyright your work. There are people on this forum whose business is producing templates, layouts and embellishments for sale. I'm sure they copyright their products.

I mean, it was my work and I should not have to defend my own work, just to get the dang thing printed.

...I honestly do not know where a lot of my stuff came from.

If you don't know where your material came from, can you say with certainty that it's completely your work?

There was an incident here a while ago where someone posted text embellishments that had to be removed because the copyright owner notified SBM. That owner lost potential sales and, more importantly, there may now be copies on other people's PCs that are being shared and copied because the person who downloaded them "had no idea where they came from."

I'm not trying to be argumentative but just presenting another perspective. I get requests on a daily basis to use my photos. My standard rates range from $250 to over $10,000 depending on usage and circulation. If I lose control over my images, I lose not just money but my business.

I don't think anyone on this site consciously violates copyrights. It's just that you're all enthusiastic about scrapbooking and SBM and sometimes don't see the business side. That's why businesses have to monitor their own assets.

poppabob wrote:

...an over zealous and greedy legal system going after the deep pockets rather than going after the thief.

Well, that's a whole different issue. The excesses of the legal tort system are legendary but that's how Americans and capitalism work. Until people decide to change the system, that's the only recourse. Even when the companies go after the "thief" such as the RIAA suits against music downloaders, there's a hue and cry about "over zealous" tactics.

When I catch someone using my photos without a license, I sue for the maximum possible to set an example. But, if someone asks first, I often just let them use it with a nominal payment. I've let small groups that I know don't have any money use photos in return for a nice "thank you" letter.

I think the apropos phrase here is, "it all depends on whose ox is being gored." Now that I've made myself perfectly unwelcome here, I think I'll just slink away...

[MaggieMae]

You are welcome!

Hi Lee,

Don't feel unwelcome! We can all use a legal tuneup! Your input and suggestions have been invaluable to all of us. Most scrapbookers (especially those of us who were traditional scrapbookers) before the big boom in scrapbooking and, particularly, digital scrapbooking, considered "cropying" the highest form of praise. Now that the digital world has opened the possibility of endlessly using created items it's appropriate that we keep learning the "dos and don'ts".

For those of us who have collected freebies long before we knew we would use them and neglected to take down names, etc., when downloading them, we are hoping it's all right to use them and mention they are freebies when we post a layout in the gallery. We are not sharing them but using them. If this, too, is a sticky wicket we may all just stop posting our work in the gallery for fear of infringement or causing trouble for SBM. I hope I have explained this well enough and would truly appreciate clarification.

On the postive side - we are all learning to keep track of our downloads and attribute them to the artists when we post layouts in the gallery. I've tried to include the appropriate names in all my new download files.

Your input is valued!

Sincerely,
MaggieMae aka Julie

[crops2dawn]

I ditto that Maggie Mae! I could just see it now... No Images in the gallery... what would be the use of having one then? I think and it's just my opinion that if it says Freebie, it just that a freebie and one can use it anyway he or she want to! Why are they called freebies anyway if god forbid you use it and can be sued !
I thought that when you post in the gallery it just that ,a post ,your not selling it, just showing others what you have done.

Onie, its a shame we don’t see more of your work , I’d love to see your work and all the freebies you got and how you used them, that’s what scrapping is all about, If I would see someone using something I made I would feel honored and never would sue ya! lol
Any how I’m done ranting, Just an opinion thats all.

[MaggieMae]

Yesss!

We don't want to scare away people from posting layouts to the gallery! It would be a shame - especially since they aren't sharing the elements with anyone! And OnieRN please post some of your layouts! We would love to see them and just mention you were using freebies and didn't remember the artist!
We don't want the fun to go out of digital scrapbooking and go back to our paper and glue sticks!!!

[poppabob]

I think the apropos phrase here is, "it all depends on whose ox is being gored." Now that I've made myself perfectly unwelcome here, I think I'll just slink away...

Nah, it's an open forum and a very valid discussion. I take no offense and certainly meant none.

Your opinion and views are widely respected here and I'm very glad you take the time out from your business to speak up.